Has anyone here used a cocktail drum in studio recordings. My band is already working on their next CD and I plan on playing my cocktail set throughout the entire album.
I've never recorded with a cocktail set and I'm wondering what I should look out for to prevent problems in the studio.
-Joe
recording
Recording Cocktail
Hey Joe,
Actually recording a Cocktail Kit is fairly easy. I have found that most engineers are really into them as well! (always good when you get the engineer excited)
Usually you just close mic the kick and whatever you have on top. You have a top snare and a small tom right? Then, for an overhead you can easily get away with one mic above to catch the cymbals and overall sound of the kit or use a couple of directional mics to pick up different zones on top (if you use just one mic you eliminate any potential phasing problems).
If you are well isolated from the band and in a nice sounding room that actually enhances the sound of the kit, try a room mic as well. Some rooms will do NOTHING for a Cocktail Drum so all you get is a thin brittle sound. If that is the case, don't even bother.
If the studio has a nice ribbon mic, try that for the overhead. They seem to always work great on the cocktail.
One final bit of advice, since Cocktail Drums are strange beasts and we usually have to use more extreme head/tuning combinations, you might be suprised at what you get when a microphone is place 1-2 inches from the head. Spend some time listening carefully with your ear close to the drum. Get your head down next to the bottom head and hit the pedal or get someone else to play while you listen up close.
I find on my own kit that to make the cock sound good acoustically I leave it fairly resonant so the tone can develope (14" drum) but with a mic right up on it I get a little to much of a Dhoooooooowwww sound. My top head (snare) is cranked up high and has a lot of life to it live. Again maybe a bit to much for close micing. I either muffle it slightly or (depending on the music) pull the mic further away from the head. Close micing on my snare also gets a lot of low resonance off of the shell. If this happens, back off the mic or you can roll off the low end with eq.
Ok, a long rant but I hope this is helpful. The main thing is get your sounds and then forget that you are recording and have fun playing. I think that you'll be psyched with the Cocktail Kit!
- John
Actually recording a Cocktail Kit is fairly easy. I have found that most engineers are really into them as well! (always good when you get the engineer excited)
Usually you just close mic the kick and whatever you have on top. You have a top snare and a small tom right? Then, for an overhead you can easily get away with one mic above to catch the cymbals and overall sound of the kit or use a couple of directional mics to pick up different zones on top (if you use just one mic you eliminate any potential phasing problems).
If you are well isolated from the band and in a nice sounding room that actually enhances the sound of the kit, try a room mic as well. Some rooms will do NOTHING for a Cocktail Drum so all you get is a thin brittle sound. If that is the case, don't even bother.
If the studio has a nice ribbon mic, try that for the overhead. They seem to always work great on the cocktail.
One final bit of advice, since Cocktail Drums are strange beasts and we usually have to use more extreme head/tuning combinations, you might be suprised at what you get when a microphone is place 1-2 inches from the head. Spend some time listening carefully with your ear close to the drum. Get your head down next to the bottom head and hit the pedal or get someone else to play while you listen up close.
I find on my own kit that to make the cock sound good acoustically I leave it fairly resonant so the tone can develope (14" drum) but with a mic right up on it I get a little to much of a Dhoooooooowwww sound. My top head (snare) is cranked up high and has a lot of life to it live. Again maybe a bit to much for close micing. I either muffle it slightly or (depending on the music) pull the mic further away from the head. Close micing on my snare also gets a lot of low resonance off of the shell. If this happens, back off the mic or you can roll off the low end with eq.
Ok, a long rant but I hope this is helpful. The main thing is get your sounds and then forget that you are recording and have fun playing. I think that you'll be psyched with the Cocktail Kit!
- John
-
palacki808
- Posts: 152
- Joined: Fri Oct 10, 2003 10:50 am
- Contact:
recording
Thanks John, that's just the type of info I was looking for. I've been in studios a half dozen times with several different bands and this is the first time I'll be using a different set. I've had my hipgig set for every bit of studio work I've done, so using the cocktial set in the studio is entirely new to me.
I'll be certain to bring up everything you mentioned to the engineer. I know he's never recorded a cocktail set before. Thanks for all the info.
-Joe
I'll be certain to bring up everything you mentioned to the engineer. I know he's never recorded a cocktail set before. Thanks for all the info.
-Joe
-
PM
recording
Hi,
It is funny to come across this thread. I'm a recording engineer by trade & got into playing cocktail drums (had never played drums before) because someone brought one in to the studio & it sounded fantastic. I started reading up on the comings & goings here & bought one for myself. Damn you all! Making me spend money on drums!
Seriously, this forum has been most inspiring.
Here's the setup we used on that initial session. The kit was a club jordan w/just the snare add-on. (no tom) and a couple of cymbals.
Audio technica ATM25, miking the kick from the bottom (!), which we used as an accent mic. Important: solve your squeakies in yr pedal first & pay very close attention to phase when miking from the beater side!
One pair Neumann KM84 small dia. condensors for overheads, spaced pair, about 2.5 feet off the kit.
It's important to take this measurement w/a grain of salt. Like the drums themselves, mics behave differently in different rooms. Given that many cocktail kits don't cover a lot of real estate, you only need 1 or 2 mikes if you're in a good room.
I'm a huge fan of minimal drum miking, when I can find a drummer who can really balance the kit well in a good room, I'm a happy camper. Generally, you'll find it easier to get a good sound out of fewer mics rather than more.
Pat
It is funny to come across this thread. I'm a recording engineer by trade & got into playing cocktail drums (had never played drums before) because someone brought one in to the studio & it sounded fantastic. I started reading up on the comings & goings here & bought one for myself. Damn you all! Making me spend money on drums!
Seriously, this forum has been most inspiring.Here's the setup we used on that initial session. The kit was a club jordan w/just the snare add-on. (no tom) and a couple of cymbals.
Audio technica ATM25, miking the kick from the bottom (!), which we used as an accent mic. Important: solve your squeakies in yr pedal first & pay very close attention to phase when miking from the beater side!
One pair Neumann KM84 small dia. condensors for overheads, spaced pair, about 2.5 feet off the kit.
It's important to take this measurement w/a grain of salt. Like the drums themselves, mics behave differently in different rooms. Given that many cocktail kits don't cover a lot of real estate, you only need 1 or 2 mikes if you're in a good room.
I'm a huge fan of minimal drum miking, when I can find a drummer who can really balance the kit well in a good room, I'm a happy camper. Generally, you'll find it easier to get a good sound out of fewer mics rather than more.
Pat
-
palacki808
- Posts: 152
- Joined: Fri Oct 10, 2003 10:50 am
- Contact:
recording
My band is now in the final round of the Graffiti Rock Challenge and at this point in the finals, the worst we can do is fourth place. That means we have already won a decent amount of studio time, we'll be in the studio quicker than we thought now that we have that. I'm going to print the posts out and take it into the studio with me when I record. I'm sure this info will help alot. Thanks guys, its great having others who are willing to make suggestions and offer advice.
-Joe
-Joe