Hi all,
I have just finished adjusting the full suite of heads I have replaced since getting my new kit. On my snare and tom I have remo coated ambassadors for batter side, and clear ambassadors for resonant side, coated ambassador for the top of my floor-bass and clear ambassador on the bottom with an aquarian 'kick-pad'. The bottom head of the drum is partially muffled across its diameter by a small cushion on the inside laying against the shell and head. The top head is slightly muffled by a small piece of gaffa tape just to kill the high overtones. Both heads are tuned to the same pitch. I am getting a really nice wet, deep, floor-tom sound like you might imagine gene playing in 'sing, sing, sing', and the bass drum note is clear, muffled and low with a lot of punch. The sound of the floor-bass drum is is the most satisfying for me at the moment.
Has anybody had any experience with the floor-bass top and bottom tuned to the same pitch? My original motivation for this was to avoid the need to eliminate cross-interaction between the heads, because the interaction would be desired. I am still interested in experimenting with a baffle, and the top head some what higher.
Does anybody have any tips on achieving a good snare sound from the small 8X5.5" side-snare? I find when i have the snares adjusted as I prefer them, they are being rattle by my floor-bass too much. No amount of tinkering with tissues/cotton balls and tension can seem to satisfy me. I was thinking of perhaps a suspension mount to further isolate the two drums. Also, I am currently using a clear ambassador for my snare side, this doesn't seem optimal to me, but was the best I could find at a pinch. Does anybody have any recommendations on a good 8 inch snare side head? I don't want to sacrifice the pure tom-tom sound when snares are off.
Incidentally, I have just discovered that those claw mounting mechanisms are a god send!
Cheers all,
Hayden.
heads and tuning
Hi - wanted to respond your mention of tuning the big drum top/bottom.....
My drum is a maple 14x24 so the fundamental pitch is going to be a bit different from that of a 15 or 16-inch drum. Most recently I've found a satisfying sound for this drum is to tune for maximum resonance, which is both heads at roughly the same pitch.
The bottom head is a clear pinstripe with an attack pad, slight additional muffling around the edge and holding a low but stable pitch with lug locks. The top head is an Evans G2 coated, as is or with a small slice of moongel. Not altogether different from what you're doing. On top I get a low tom tone with good (stick) attack and a defined but round note from the bottom.
There are some cons to this approach... articulation with brushes is not as good as it would be if the top head were tuned higher, and necessary if snares were in place. Tuning the bottom way down and muffling more would give a tighter thud.
When I've tuned each head differently - ie to get a thud on bottom and a med high-pitched tom tone on top, I haven't achieved an optimal sound from each.
Using one drum for 2 sounds comes with some compromise. One thing for sure, I've experimented with several different heads top and bottom, lots of different tunings, and differnt degrees and kinds of muffling, and keep an open mind and ear. I'm bound to change it again sometime!
Good luck as you search for your sound.
My drum is a maple 14x24 so the fundamental pitch is going to be a bit different from that of a 15 or 16-inch drum. Most recently I've found a satisfying sound for this drum is to tune for maximum resonance, which is both heads at roughly the same pitch.
The bottom head is a clear pinstripe with an attack pad, slight additional muffling around the edge and holding a low but stable pitch with lug locks. The top head is an Evans G2 coated, as is or with a small slice of moongel. Not altogether different from what you're doing. On top I get a low tom tone with good (stick) attack and a defined but round note from the bottom.
There are some cons to this approach... articulation with brushes is not as good as it would be if the top head were tuned higher, and necessary if snares were in place. Tuning the bottom way down and muffling more would give a tighter thud.
When I've tuned each head differently - ie to get a thud on bottom and a med high-pitched tom tone on top, I haven't achieved an optimal sound from each.
Using one drum for 2 sounds comes with some compromise. One thing for sure, I've experimented with several different heads top and bottom, lots of different tunings, and differnt degrees and kinds of muffling, and keep an open mind and ear. I'm bound to change it again sometime!
Good luck as you search for your sound.
Just picked up a black evans resonant head for my 10inch tom, and a clear evans genera resonant for my 8inch snare/tom. I suspect this will greatly enhance both the tom sound and the snare sound. I will post accounts as soon as I have finished experimenting. Batters all Remo coated Ambassadors, bass batter clear ambassador.
Hopefully soon, I will be comfortable with the adjustments with this kit, and stick up some media.
Hayden.
Hopefully soon, I will be comfortable with the adjustments with this kit, and stick up some media.
Hayden.
My suspicions were right! The sound I am getting from the 8 inch snare is incredible with the coated ambassador / evans genera resonant combination. Both heads tuned to same tension, fairly mid range, with just a tinge of muffling on the batter head. I was kind of trying to get that "wallet on the snare" character, and from such a small drum, ended up using a small patch of gaffa with some folded light material underneath. The drum is produceing a nicer snare sound than i ever achieved on my 14 inch snare on my old 5pce kit.
As for the 10inch tom, resonance and clarity and projection has greatly increased, so with even less batter muffling than on the snare, I have good a nice round warm tone. This drum was a real bitch to tune with the black evans resonant skin, it seemed very temperamental, and took hours just to get the black head in tune with itself. The tedium was worth it though, and of course a massive improvement over the default heads supplied.
After playing around with the floor-bass drum, I am now happy with the stick on top sound, but not the foot beater sound. Though not bad, this will require further experimenting with head choice and damping.
Does anybody have any tuning success stories to tell?
Hayden.
As for the 10inch tom, resonance and clarity and projection has greatly increased, so with even less batter muffling than on the snare, I have good a nice round warm tone. This drum was a real bitch to tune with the black evans resonant skin, it seemed very temperamental, and took hours just to get the black head in tune with itself. The tedium was worth it though, and of course a massive improvement over the default heads supplied.
After playing around with the floor-bass drum, I am now happy with the stick on top sound, but not the foot beater sound. Though not bad, this will require further experimenting with head choice and damping.
Does anybody have any tuning success stories to tell?
Hayden.
-
jim kooser
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 3:39 pm
My big drum is a 24 x 14 floor tom/bass combo, with an Evans Hydraulic on the bottom and an Evans EC2 on top. I tuned the bottom head pretty low, just enough to get the wrinkles out, then a turn more. Top head is tuned a touch higher than the bottom. I have a felt strip to muffle the bottom head, nothing on the top. I get a nice thump off the bottom, and a pleasant floor tom sound, perhaps a bit higher tone than the "sing sing sing" reference. Top head sounds good with sticks and brushes.
I also have an 8 inch snare, with similar heads. I bought it used, it rang like crazy at first. I trued up and rounded the bearing edges a tad (they were originally very sharp double 45's), and played with the head tension a bit. I currently play the drum tuned pretty high, top and bottom heads tuned the same, and its a cracky little beast with a nice snap. Good with sticks and rods, too small for brushes to sound good though.
I also have an 8 inch snare, with similar heads. I bought it used, it rang like crazy at first. I trued up and rounded the bearing edges a tad (they were originally very sharp double 45's), and played with the head tension a bit. I currently play the drum tuned pretty high, top and bottom heads tuned the same, and its a cracky little beast with a nice snap. Good with sticks and rods, too small for brushes to sound good though.
I'm using Fiberskyn(sp)On top a G2 on bottom. I did drill my club Jordan and installed
(2) top and bottom Gretsch vintage muffles. My Tom is Fiberskyn top and bottom and I gave up on 8 snare and am using a 80"s DW 10 Maple snare. It takes more room but isolating snare really helps on reducing "Buzz"
As far as tunning I too tune top and bottom in same general area. I tend to go more for
Kick sound...Need that bass....Tom side is slill very floor tom sounding. I tune my side(small)tom very loose for a lower tone than snare without snares engaged. I also play sitting down with real HH. Pearl eliminator pedal has improved my kick speed substantially over yamahas factory model
Finding a cocktail forum is "Wonderful"....I'm going to learn a bunch from you guys
thanks
Peace
Bongo
(2) top and bottom Gretsch vintage muffles. My Tom is Fiberskyn top and bottom and I gave up on 8 snare and am using a 80"s DW 10 Maple snare. It takes more room but isolating snare really helps on reducing "Buzz"
As far as tunning I too tune top and bottom in same general area. I tend to go more for
Kick sound...Need that bass....Tom side is slill very floor tom sounding. I tune my side(small)tom very loose for a lower tone than snare without snares engaged. I also play sitting down with real HH. Pearl eliminator pedal has improved my kick speed substantially over yamahas factory model
Finding a cocktail forum is "Wonderful"....I'm going to learn a bunch from you guys
thanks
Peace
Bongo
Thank you for your input BongoJimi, your reaction to finding a cocktail drum forum was about the same as mine was when I found it, and I echo your sentiments entirely. Welcome aboard!
If you haven't already read it, you might be interested in checking out my thread on the external tone control (mufflers) that are available: viewtopic.php?t=778 I didn't have the nerve to drill into my kit.
I will be able to post a report on my experience with some new heads, including an Evans hydraulic, in the very near future (just finished my exams which were keeping me away from my drums!). And also stay tuned for some interesting cymbal configurations.
Regards,
Hayden.
If you haven't already read it, you might be interested in checking out my thread on the external tone control (mufflers) that are available: viewtopic.php?t=778 I didn't have the nerve to drill into my kit.
I will be able to post a report on my experience with some new heads, including an Evans hydraulic, in the very near future (just finished my exams which were keeping me away from my drums!). And also stay tuned for some interesting cymbal configurations.
Regards,
Hayden.
Hayden
I'm a vintage drum Freak...and I would never drill a shell or alter it. I don't consider my club Jordan a vintage set and therefore didn't have any quams about improving my tunability. All of the best sets(vintage) had factory installed internal muffles. The Newer gears rarely has it. Gretsch was way ahead of the curve in the 60's and 70's with their dual(top & Bottom) muffles.
I have nothing against over-ring on a set of drums but I like my kits warm and woody sounding...Hence the fiberskyn heads and muffles. Moon gels are a legitimate alternative but they leave an ink-spot on your heads.
Us old farts ,me in particular will do just about anything to get the sound we're looking for.
I plan on reading the above mentioned thread and am sure you'll find the Evans Hydralic heads will definately put a new sound on your kit. I used them for many years on my rock kits. Love that "Cement Block" being dropped into a "well" SOUND. Great low ends.
THUMMMP.
Good luck on your drum journey....it's a wonderful trip
Peace
BONGO
I'm a vintage drum Freak...and I would never drill a shell or alter it. I don't consider my club Jordan a vintage set and therefore didn't have any quams about improving my tunability. All of the best sets(vintage) had factory installed internal muffles. The Newer gears rarely has it. Gretsch was way ahead of the curve in the 60's and 70's with their dual(top & Bottom) muffles.
I have nothing against over-ring on a set of drums but I like my kits warm and woody sounding...Hence the fiberskyn heads and muffles. Moon gels are a legitimate alternative but they leave an ink-spot on your heads.
Us old farts ,me in particular will do just about anything to get the sound we're looking for.
I plan on reading the above mentioned thread and am sure you'll find the Evans Hydralic heads will definately put a new sound on your kit. I used them for many years on my rock kits. Love that "Cement Block" being dropped into a "well" SOUND. Great low ends.
THUMMMP.
Good luck on your drum journey....it's a wonderful trip
Peace
BONGO