I'm so geeked!
I finally got my baffle to work, thanks to enough suggestions to finally duke it out with masonite. I duked it out with my wife's jig saw, cut the pieces close enough to fit, put two pieces of foam between them and a rubber vaccum practice pad on top of the baffle, crammed the thing in past the reinforcing hoops, and voila--it looks like crap on the inside and sounds great on the outside.
I might still follow the suggestion to use a coated diplomat on top to get a crisper snare sound, but the bass drum sounds great. I have coated ambassador on the bottom, and all I did to muffle it was take a snowball-sized wad of fiberfill and let it float on the head. It bounces up to give the bass drum a full sound, then lands on it immediately after to tighten it. It's perfect.
I also bought a 17" remix ride, and it kicks ass. So all that's really left is to finish the drum and buy floor tom bracket or two to make all the odds and ends connect without stands.
I figured out two new sounds today, too. I've been looking to keep the drum as minimalistic as possible, and I figured out that a good whack on the main shell is a good woodblock substitute.
Also, I turned the snares off and found that the drum makes a surprisingly good conga. The slaps sound almost exactly like a conga slap, and with a 10" tom on the set, I can treat that as the conga and the drum as the quinto. So that saves me the trouble of ever lugging around a conga to a show.
I'm finding I like the drum a lot better with brushes than with sticks, but I'll experiment with some novelty sticks.
Just thought I'd share my glee.
FW
whoohoo!
Baffles!
Hey FW,
Congrats on the baffle!
One of these days I'll have to try it myself (I've been really happy with my super tight top/loose bottom combo so I haven't bothered). Sounds like masonite is the trick!
Playing on the side of the drum is a classic cocktail technique. Works great! Also try playing hi hat patterns on the shell using hotrods or blasticks.
I play with sticks alot BUT I find that you can't play super hard (especially near the center of the head) or the snare snaps back at you and sounds crappy. If you search I bet you can find at least two sweet spots on the head with sticks that will be fairly loud and have good tone without having to hit hard. Try a rim shot with the tip of the stick about 2" into the head for a ringy pop sound. 4-5 " in for a more 'normal' sound (with or without rim shot)
I think that my all time favorite snare sound on my drum is with a modified blastick. Take a piece of duct tape and wrap it tight an inch and a half from the tip. This gives the blastick some meat and you can play nice quiet ghost notes too.
Give it a try!
John
Congrats on the baffle!
One of these days I'll have to try it myself (I've been really happy with my super tight top/loose bottom combo so I haven't bothered). Sounds like masonite is the trick!
Playing on the side of the drum is a classic cocktail technique. Works great! Also try playing hi hat patterns on the shell using hotrods or blasticks.
I play with sticks alot BUT I find that you can't play super hard (especially near the center of the head) or the snare snaps back at you and sounds crappy. If you search I bet you can find at least two sweet spots on the head with sticks that will be fairly loud and have good tone without having to hit hard. Try a rim shot with the tip of the stick about 2" into the head for a ringy pop sound. 4-5 " in for a more 'normal' sound (with or without rim shot)
I think that my all time favorite snare sound on my drum is with a modified blastick. Take a piece of duct tape and wrap it tight an inch and a half from the tip. This gives the blastick some meat and you can play nice quiet ghost notes too.
Give it a try!
John
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fw
Thanks for the encouragement, guys!
You know, I have been super lazy about taking pictures. I don't have a digital camera or a scanner, but at the same time, I want to try to get my drum into drumset of the month in Modern Drummer, so I really ought to document the thing. I have to take the whole thing apart again to put the covering on it anyway, so at that point I'll take pictures.
One thing about my drum that will make taking the baffle out without destroying it impossible: my drum is made of two 1960 Ludwig 12x15 marching snare drums with reinforcing rings, so I had to bend the masonite discs to get them into the drum, and I can't remove them now that they are in. I also couldn't check for a perfect fit--I only got one shot, so my baffle is in kind of crooked. The masonite is that 1/4" brown stuff and I cut it with an electric jigsaw. In between I have two 1" discs of green foam from a fabric store. Above the baffle, I have a 14" Ludwig Billy Gladstone rubber vacuum practice pad, and that thing just kills all the upward air flow from the bass drum. I can't believe the difference it makes. I have a 2 1/2" vent above the baffle and one below, and until I added the practice pad, I still got a ton of air shooting out of the top vent whenever I hit the bass drum. Now I have none.
I've also thought about getting two bass drum legs that could fit into the floor tom leg sockets and using the drum as a traditional bass drum, with my 10" tom and a 16x12 Slingerland floor tom I'm restoring for my main set. That way I'd have a bop set if I want one.
Speaking of rods on the shell--I'm really debating whether or not to have hi hats on the set at all. With the hi hats always closed, they don't give me more than two or three sound options, and many of the sounds could be implied with a brush on the head or some hot rods on the shell. I'll probably leave them, though, just because they are super cool 70's 12" A Zildjians and I love them.
I've found some decent zones for playing the top head with sticks, but my issue is that the drum still sounds so choked, like a marching drum (which it basically is). It is incredibly articulate but also muted because of the snares being under the head. Also, as I tighten it to get into the pitch range I want, I choke it more. That might be one of the disadvantages of a 15" drum...getting the tone of a 14" snare demands tighter tension. I really like the coated diplomat idea to solve the problem.
Thanks again to everyone on the list for all the ideas.
FW
You know, I have been super lazy about taking pictures. I don't have a digital camera or a scanner, but at the same time, I want to try to get my drum into drumset of the month in Modern Drummer, so I really ought to document the thing. I have to take the whole thing apart again to put the covering on it anyway, so at that point I'll take pictures.
One thing about my drum that will make taking the baffle out without destroying it impossible: my drum is made of two 1960 Ludwig 12x15 marching snare drums with reinforcing rings, so I had to bend the masonite discs to get them into the drum, and I can't remove them now that they are in. I also couldn't check for a perfect fit--I only got one shot, so my baffle is in kind of crooked. The masonite is that 1/4" brown stuff and I cut it with an electric jigsaw. In between I have two 1" discs of green foam from a fabric store. Above the baffle, I have a 14" Ludwig Billy Gladstone rubber vacuum practice pad, and that thing just kills all the upward air flow from the bass drum. I can't believe the difference it makes. I have a 2 1/2" vent above the baffle and one below, and until I added the practice pad, I still got a ton of air shooting out of the top vent whenever I hit the bass drum. Now I have none.
I've also thought about getting two bass drum legs that could fit into the floor tom leg sockets and using the drum as a traditional bass drum, with my 10" tom and a 16x12 Slingerland floor tom I'm restoring for my main set. That way I'd have a bop set if I want one.
Speaking of rods on the shell--I'm really debating whether or not to have hi hats on the set at all. With the hi hats always closed, they don't give me more than two or three sound options, and many of the sounds could be implied with a brush on the head or some hot rods on the shell. I'll probably leave them, though, just because they are super cool 70's 12" A Zildjians and I love them.
I've found some decent zones for playing the top head with sticks, but my issue is that the drum still sounds so choked, like a marching drum (which it basically is). It is incredibly articulate but also muted because of the snares being under the head. Also, as I tighten it to get into the pitch range I want, I choke it more. That might be one of the disadvantages of a 15" drum...getting the tone of a 14" snare demands tighter tension. I really like the coated diplomat idea to solve the problem.
Thanks again to everyone on the list for all the ideas.
FW
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palacki808
- Posts: 152
- Joined: Fri Oct 10, 2003 10:50 am
- Contact:
baffle?
Sounds like you have found the perfect baffle. Did you attach the rubber vacuum pad in some way or does it just sit on top of the baffle? And how did you attach the baffle to the inside of the shell? I'd like to try this in my drum.
-joe
-joe
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fw
Hey Joe!
I think it is a perfect baffle for my drum in all respects but one--it is ugly as hell.
It's hard to cut a perfect circle with a jigsaw, but I came close enough for the discs to work.
The issue with my drum is that it has reinforcing rings, so once the baffle is in, and can't come out again unless I take a saws-all and chop it up.
The baffle fits snug enough to hold itself in--so snug, in fact, that I can't make it perpindicular to the shell--it's in crooked because I must have cut part of it too wide.
As far as attaching the vacuum pad, my drum is only about 80% complete at this point, so the pad just rests on the baffle. My plan, though, is to use contact cement to glue it down. If I don't, it will shift around whenever I move the drum and might not slide back to the proper spot. I don't want to have to shake the drum around to get it back in place at a gig.
Really, the idea for the baffle is the same as Keith or Dinkus'. Almost everyone seems to use masonite, and I feel like a dork for not trying it sooner. As for the filling material, Keith prefers fiber fill, but I had better luck with foam. He has a 16" and I have a 15"--I don't know if that makes a difference. I have a feeling his baffle is thinner than mine, which is a plus for his bass drum tone. I'm happy with my bass tone, though--it's tight and punchy, which isn't my usual tone, but for the drum, it works well. And I really like the rubber pad on top--I'd say I have less rattle from my snare on the cocktail set then I have on any of my traditional sets. At any rate, it seems like everyone likes the masonite or plywood "oreo" idea.
The masonite has virtually no chance to work as a resonating head with the pad on top. My hunch is that the infinitessimal amount of snare rattle I get comes from vibrations in the shell, not through the baffle.
I think it is a perfect baffle for my drum in all respects but one--it is ugly as hell.
It's hard to cut a perfect circle with a jigsaw, but I came close enough for the discs to work.
The issue with my drum is that it has reinforcing rings, so once the baffle is in, and can't come out again unless I take a saws-all and chop it up.
The baffle fits snug enough to hold itself in--so snug, in fact, that I can't make it perpindicular to the shell--it's in crooked because I must have cut part of it too wide.
As far as attaching the vacuum pad, my drum is only about 80% complete at this point, so the pad just rests on the baffle. My plan, though, is to use contact cement to glue it down. If I don't, it will shift around whenever I move the drum and might not slide back to the proper spot. I don't want to have to shake the drum around to get it back in place at a gig.
Really, the idea for the baffle is the same as Keith or Dinkus'. Almost everyone seems to use masonite, and I feel like a dork for not trying it sooner. As for the filling material, Keith prefers fiber fill, but I had better luck with foam. He has a 16" and I have a 15"--I don't know if that makes a difference. I have a feeling his baffle is thinner than mine, which is a plus for his bass drum tone. I'm happy with my bass tone, though--it's tight and punchy, which isn't my usual tone, but for the drum, it works well. And I really like the rubber pad on top--I'd say I have less rattle from my snare on the cocktail set then I have on any of my traditional sets. At any rate, it seems like everyone likes the masonite or plywood "oreo" idea.
The masonite has virtually no chance to work as a resonating head with the pad on top. My hunch is that the infinitessimal amount of snare rattle I get comes from vibrations in the shell, not through the baffle.